Comments on Five Hole Fanatics: Every move the wrong one

Agree that whoever gets Zherdev will be getting a ...

2009-08-05T12:34:47.705-06:00

Agree that whoever gets Zherdev will be getting a bargain. Despite the spoonfed info to local writers that Zherdev wants to bolt to the KHL, his agent says he wants to stay in the NHL.

There has a lot of informal speculation since the QO was rejected that he's is going to end up in Detroit.

No problem about the "hijack" guys...I a...

2009-08-05T00:14:38.149-06:00

No problem about the "hijack" guys...I actually find the discussion really interesting (moreso than the original article, actually). Maybe I'll make fun of Sather more often!

Brent -

I think whoever scoops Zherdev will get a bargain. He's UFA now and is going to get paid whatever the market will bear...given that a lot of decent players are still waiting for jobs, I'm guessing that will be less than the 3.9M he won in arbitration.

That said, there's little chance it'll be the Flames. I actualluy think the Sarich/Zherdev swap would make sense, but I can't see Sutter coveting a player like Zherdev, especially over precious "defensive depth". Not at this time at least.

I wonder how Sutter gets Zherdev to really round t...

2009-08-04T21:56:44.263-06:00

I wonder how Sutter gets Zherdev to really round this summer out to being the best summer anyone could hope for. I suggest substituting Sarichs contract for Zherdevs. The teams much better off and you will get a decent return for Sarich. By my count we have no 1st or 2nd round pick next year. You must think Sarich could fetch either/or.

Squab- Can't take issue with any of that. Wor...

2009-08-04T21:31:38.375-06:00

Squab-

Can't take issue with any of that. Worth mentioning that a lot of the dumbing down of reporting occurs at the editotial level as well.

Ironic that Zherdev's 'replacement' is Kotalik, a player with a well established reputation as a lazy european. Ah, details...

Apologies as well for hijacking the article, although it seems we've kept it basically on-topic. If you're interested in more-substantive-than-usual Ranger talk there's a discussion group I'll link to that you're welcome to check out. No need to trouble these nice people with our problems...

pemoco- I guess we're kind of talking about t...

2009-08-04T21:04:36.474-06:00

pemoco-

I guess we're kind of talking about the chicken and the egg here. I think we both agree though in saying that Sather and management don't have any type of solid plan.

I tend to think of the media and the fans as being two different sides of the same coin. Especially since when it comes to the hockey media in New York there are few to no reporters with the intelligence or credentials to put out unique opinions. I think guys like Brooks and Carpiniello etc. gauge and predict the reactions of the fanbase and write their pieces to be in accordance with those reactions.

I think we'd both agree too in saying that there isn't enough of a "seperation of power" in the Rangers universe. Management and the media are too intrinsically connected to make decisions completely independent of each other. The hockey media here in NYC is so marginalized and desperate for column space/airtime that they aren't in a position to propogate opinions that are contrary to the beliefs of the fanbase. Essentially, whatever remnants of a hockey media we have here in NYC is held hostage to the whims of the mob. Hence, you get Brooks' ripping of Zherdev and Avery (pre-return).

The Zherdev case is especially interesting because all three "states" united to produce the result. At some point, the NY media decided to apply the "lazy European" stereotype to Zherdev and make him the heir to the Malik scapegoat throne. Whether they came up with this strategy on their own at the behest of management I don't really know. The Ranger fanbase subsequently embraced this theory as a means of being the ultimate explanation for why we lost to the Caps in the first round. Therefore, management had no problem letting him go for nothing.

Sorry for hijacking your article here Kent but I follow your work here and on M&G and rarely get a chance to comment on Ranger news.

Squab- I look at it is the other way 'round -...

2009-08-04T20:41:27.719-06:00

Squab-

I look at it is the other way 'round - that the mob takes their cue from the media. If you are here in the vortex you see/hear it with all the NY area pro sports teams. (Can't wait until the 'Joba has to go back to the bullpen' mob put away their torches and pitchforks.) In this case the team ownership has the ability to shape what the media is saying. There has been a systematic demonization of Zherdev, the same way there was when Avery signed in Dallas - which changed as soon as he came back. Whatever moves are made are given some idiotic spin that is then parroted until it's 'truth'. And Sather has sure seemed to go out of his way to insult Ranger fans from hiring Trottier, to benching Lundmark in favor of Billy Tibbetts, and signing such mortal enemies as Holik and now Brashear. Can't wait until we can thank him for the memories.

Back to the point. With Zherdev, management soured on him before the fans did. Sather likes playing hardball, and he won again. Zherdev will end up somewhere like Detroit. Guess who loses?

Interesting comments, obviously from long sufferin...

2009-08-04T20:20:56.634-06:00

Interesting comments, obviously from long suffering Rangers fans. Don't know how you guys put with this stuff sometimes.

I'll take a look at some of the Brooks articles here soon.

pemoco- That's my point. The local media cat...

2009-08-04T20:09:27.766-06:00

pemoco-

That's my point. The local media caters to the mob mentality of the fan base and ownership treats those opinions as holy. Sather and company don't really have a coherent view as to how to build a team. Instead, they just ride the wind of fan opinions and media coverage.

Zherdev is gone not because of a lack of production on the ice but rather because the fanbase and the local media soured on him.

Kent- you should take a look at some of the axe jobs Larry Brooks has been putting out in the NY Post about Zherdev recently. It's a real interesting study in how providing misinformation about little-known topics such as arbitration and the CBA can influence the opinions of a fanbase and consequently, Rangers management.

Squab - There a fans of every team that can flau...

2009-08-04T19:51:12.997-06:00

Squab -

There a fans of every team that can flaunt their stupidity on the local sports radio. Let me tell you, it's no treat having a media company as your owner. Cablevision has systematically ruined their teams by pandering to lowest common denominator among the fanbase. They have fired broadcasters who have dared to speak honest criticism of the teams. They leak stories through their paper - Newsday. There is no long-term view, and they will do a 180 in a heartbeat. I wish I could provide you with examples over time of their coverage of Avery's comings and goings. Point is, there are plenty of Ranger fans who see things as they are. Many have just given up until there is a major change in ownership (please) or at least upper management (guess who) but some of us masochists are hanging in there until some sort of sanity returns.

Oh, and if there is a god, Arnason doesn't see...

2009-08-04T19:40:55.473-06:00

Oh, and if there is a god, Arnason doesn't see a second of ice time outside of Hartford. Anisimov has more than earned a shot at an NHL job. There are also 3 young d-men that deserve to battle it out for the 6th d-man spot, but now that we're swimming in cap space from not signing Zherdev, it will be Babchuk or Seidenberg. Sather can't resist a bargain when it's someone else's trash on the curb, and it will leave enough cash to sign Bertuzzi - yay!! Even better, just blow the whole load on Sundin. Shoot me now.

Let's also not forget that Tyutin has flourish...

2009-08-04T19:40:21.582-06:00

Let's also not forget that Tyutin has flourished in Columbus.

Fedor Tyutin would be the Rangers number 1 D-man right now. Regardless of what the Staaliacs would have you believe.

Spot on again as usual Kent. The problem with Ran...

2009-08-04T19:34:52.510-06:00

Spot on again as usual Kent.

The problem with Rangers management is that they cater wholly to the insane demands of the Ranger fanbase. A couple of days ago on ESPN radio here in NYC Don La Greca and Michael Kay said that there are three franchises in the city that monitor the radiowaves and newspapers constantly and make decisions based off those opinions: the Mets, the Knicks and the Rangers.

Zherdev got shafted because the xenophobic and uneducated Ranger fan-base looks at him and says "He's lazy! He sucks! Give me back Jed Ortmeyer!" and Sather willingly complies.

Same thing with Gaborik. The Ranger fanbase craves for whichever big name star is available at the moment, regardless of whether or not the move actually makes sense. Cue the 5 year deal to the biggest injury risk in the league.

If Kovalchuk doesn't reup with Atlanta we'll be going through the carousel all over again in a couple of months here in NYC.

Dudley Moore: Do you feel you've learnt by you...

2009-08-04T19:34:05.243-06:00

Dudley Moore: Do you feel you've learnt by your mistakes here?

Peter Cook: I think I have, yes, and I think I can probably repeat them almost perfectly.

Using this example, Sather has definitely learned from his mistakes. The endless stupidity on both a large and small scale is mind-numbing for Ranger fans. Seriously, when does this nightmare end? Sather has had 5 coaches (including having to fire himself from that position) - what GM gets 5 coaches to prove himself. Where do you begin? He signs Matt Cullen and then allows Renney to misuse him. Don't fire the coach who is clueless, trade the player for nothing because you can sign Gomez & Drury to ridiculous FA contract. Tyutin's development stalled? Not the coach's fault, trade him for a player you aren't committed to b/c you can sign Redden & Rozsival (again!) to ridiculous cap-killing contracts. Then let the player you traded go for no compensation! Are you kidding me? Give up a 2nd rounder to rent Antropov. Give up a 3rd rounder for the useless Brian Boyle. 3 years for Kotalik when nobody else is offering 2. Not a peep from out beat writers though, they're all busy enjoying the free buffet courtesy of Cablevision, Inc. It's not going to get better anytime soon as after next season Sather has to figure out a way to sign Staal, Girardi, Dubinsky and Higgins with about $4 million available - assuming the cap doesn't go down. Light a candle Glen.

Sometimes I wonder if Sather ir running the team o...

2009-08-04T15:58:35.856-06:00

Sometimes I wonder if Sather ir running the team or if someone in upper MSG is. The Rangers have been a poorly run team for 30+ years. Esposito talked about the frustrations he had when he was the Rangers GM and it wouldn't surprise me if that was the same today.

It's equally as plausible Sather just doesn't have it anymore.

Hey, do you think we can convince Sather to swap h...

2009-08-04T15:02:28.626-06:00

Hey, do you think we can convince Sather to swap his goalie (who has never won any trophies) straight-up for our goalie (Stanley Cup finalist, former Vezina & Jennings winner)? Hey, Slats, you'd free up some cap space! Also, the Brashear signing makes even the Mcgratten signing look pretty damn good.